This book cured the monotony I was starting to feel with the last chapter. Fagles’ title though…was a choice. I wonder how the impact would have been without the spoiler! I mean, it does play into the idea that his fate was sealed, but on the other hand he was on a rampage up til his final moments and one could believe he’d survive. And now I have to add Troilus and Cressida to my overly burdened TBR…thanks. 🤣 Excellent summary though!
Agree, I find I keep drifting off during the constant battles. Especially among unfamiliar names. However, it reminds me of the war scenes in War & Peace. The relentless of war and the weariness the soldiers feel is reflected in the storytelling
Sarah, I think you are spot on with your assessment that this is similar to W&P. Homer is trying to wear us down through thematic and creative choices. All in preparation for the coming crescendo.
I kind of see that, in the sense of the weariness and feeling of inevitability/fate. But on the other hand, the main characters in War and Peace are all dealing with elements of self doubt, figuring out who they are, and unsure of their purpose. Not so, with our Homeric heroes, bursting with self-assured bravado. I think the only W&P character that might survive The Iliad is Dolokhov. 😂
Ha! Dolokhov has to be one of my favorite characters in all of literary. If he is crazy enough to wrestle a bear he can undoubtedly handle the Greek pantheon.
There is that moment many books ago when Sarpedon says he’d rather not have to fight wars. Not exactly self doubt but a little self reflection. Though not much of it
Thanks Chris. Yeah, I have seen several readers talk about the monotony of the reading and the battle scenes. I agree with that but I am wondering if it is an intentional act. As Sarah also mentions from W&P, the relentless nature of war and the weariness that comes from it. I wonder if Homer is trying to convey that to the audience.
Fagles choice of a chapter title sucks. Hands down the worst spoiler in literary history.
I read Shakespeare's complete works a couple years ago. T&C is one of his lesser known plays but I liked it.
I’m so glad you mentioned Song of Achilles as a modern retelling of Achille’s and Patroclus’s relationship. Such a beautiful, devastating book. Highly recommended companion reading for everyone on this slow read
Yes, I agree that it is an excellent choice to read alongside. I am also listening to Stephen Fry's "Mythos" which is wonderful and kind of fills in a lot of the holes and understanding about the role of the gods. It is broader than just the Trojan War but is a good supplementary read.
Matthew, I am thankful for this deep and powerful reading into Patroclus's character. I say this as not having read the Iliad yet, and trying to psych myself up for reading what I've essentially understood (and has been confirmed through comments here) as a story of battles. You've given us much to contemplate, and made this ancient tale relevant to our present moment--which, of course, all great stories no matter their era, do. But, we have to have eyes to see it.
I also appreciate all the W&P references in the comments. Do you think your reading of W&P has helped you pull out these more deeply woven threads of Patroclus's character and those greater themes you've highlighted here, that can easily be lost in Iliad's "one more battle" narrative?
Excellent reflective essay Matthew. I could not agree more that Patroclus is indeed the emotional heart of this epic. This is the tipping point, the catalyst, the heart of all that follows.
This book, like several others, certainly does not lack for blood and gore. I've come to see the detailed descriptions of battle as necessary to drive home the horrors of war. This book is also chock-full of great similes. I particularly liked the use of wolf behavior in the similes.
I didn't get the impression that Patroclus donning Achilles' armor deceived anyone into thinking that Partoclus was Achilles, but it was a powerful symbolic gesture that inspired the Myrmidons to rally around Patroclus and turn the tide. Perhaps of even more importance was Achilles' prayer to Zeus to fill Patroclus heart with courage
I like the analysis in the essay that differentiates the unselfish and principled Patroclus v other characters, both mortal and immortal, who are often motivated by greed, vanity, glory, etc. Patroclus' courage reminds me of any earlier declaration by Diomedes that courage is the greatest virtue.
But in the end even Patroclus is imperfect because he fails to heed the admonitions of Achilles. On the other hand, maybe failure to heed and resulting death was self-sacrifice by Patroclus, knowing that his death would bring Achilles off the sidelines. This is a way to look at Patroclus failure to heed as the ultimate act of courage. It also explains his unhesitating prediction of Hector's death.
This book cured the monotony I was starting to feel with the last chapter. Fagles’ title though…was a choice. I wonder how the impact would have been without the spoiler! I mean, it does play into the idea that his fate was sealed, but on the other hand he was on a rampage up til his final moments and one could believe he’d survive. And now I have to add Troilus and Cressida to my overly burdened TBR…thanks. 🤣 Excellent summary though!
Agree, I find I keep drifting off during the constant battles. Especially among unfamiliar names. However, it reminds me of the war scenes in War & Peace. The relentless of war and the weariness the soldiers feel is reflected in the storytelling
Sarah, I think you are spot on with your assessment that this is similar to W&P. Homer is trying to wear us down through thematic and creative choices. All in preparation for the coming crescendo.
I kind of see that, in the sense of the weariness and feeling of inevitability/fate. But on the other hand, the main characters in War and Peace are all dealing with elements of self doubt, figuring out who they are, and unsure of their purpose. Not so, with our Homeric heroes, bursting with self-assured bravado. I think the only W&P character that might survive The Iliad is Dolokhov. 😂
Ha! Dolokhov has to be one of my favorite characters in all of literary. If he is crazy enough to wrestle a bear he can undoubtedly handle the Greek pantheon.
Yes ... hahaha .... Dolokhov!
There is that moment many books ago when Sarpedon says he’d rather not have to fight wars. Not exactly self doubt but a little self reflection. Though not much of it
Thanks Chris. Yeah, I have seen several readers talk about the monotony of the reading and the battle scenes. I agree with that but I am wondering if it is an intentional act. As Sarah also mentions from W&P, the relentless nature of war and the weariness that comes from it. I wonder if Homer is trying to convey that to the audience.
Fagles choice of a chapter title sucks. Hands down the worst spoiler in literary history.
I read Shakespeare's complete works a couple years ago. T&C is one of his lesser known plays but I liked it.
Agree Chris .. we have been saved.
You would prefer the Wilson title perhaps, 'Love and Death'?
I’m so glad you mentioned Song of Achilles as a modern retelling of Achille’s and Patroclus’s relationship. Such a beautiful, devastating book. Highly recommended companion reading for everyone on this slow read
Yes, I agree that it is an excellent choice to read alongside. I am also listening to Stephen Fry's "Mythos" which is wonderful and kind of fills in a lot of the holes and understanding about the role of the gods. It is broader than just the Trojan War but is a good supplementary read.
Ahh, Mythos. What a great idea to read alongside Homer!
I have that in my TBR pile. Maybe I need to bring it to the top 😀
I also just found this new podcast Podyssey
https://open.spotify.com/show/2x7cD3HjkOyOKTF4YT5Goy?si=LvtRtFooQrSkL1i24wQL9g
not listened to it but could be interesting
Matthew, I am thankful for this deep and powerful reading into Patroclus's character. I say this as not having read the Iliad yet, and trying to psych myself up for reading what I've essentially understood (and has been confirmed through comments here) as a story of battles. You've given us much to contemplate, and made this ancient tale relevant to our present moment--which, of course, all great stories no matter their era, do. But, we have to have eyes to see it.
I also appreciate all the W&P references in the comments. Do you think your reading of W&P has helped you pull out these more deeply woven threads of Patroclus's character and those greater themes you've highlighted here, that can easily be lost in Iliad's "one more battle" narrative?
Finally a chapter that had me fully engaged.
Excellent reflective essay Matthew. I could not agree more that Patroclus is indeed the emotional heart of this epic. This is the tipping point, the catalyst, the heart of all that follows.
Talking of violence, NY readers can go to this talk by Emily Wilson on 9th May. I’m very jealous of those that can make it https://hunter.cuny.edu/event/emily-wilson-translating-the-iliads-violence/
This book, like several others, certainly does not lack for blood and gore. I've come to see the detailed descriptions of battle as necessary to drive home the horrors of war. This book is also chock-full of great similes. I particularly liked the use of wolf behavior in the similes.
I didn't get the impression that Patroclus donning Achilles' armor deceived anyone into thinking that Partoclus was Achilles, but it was a powerful symbolic gesture that inspired the Myrmidons to rally around Patroclus and turn the tide. Perhaps of even more importance was Achilles' prayer to Zeus to fill Patroclus heart with courage
I like the analysis in the essay that differentiates the unselfish and principled Patroclus v other characters, both mortal and immortal, who are often motivated by greed, vanity, glory, etc. Patroclus' courage reminds me of any earlier declaration by Diomedes that courage is the greatest virtue.
But in the end even Patroclus is imperfect because he fails to heed the admonitions of Achilles. On the other hand, maybe failure to heed and resulting death was self-sacrifice by Patroclus, knowing that his death would bring Achilles off the sidelines. This is a way to look at Patroclus failure to heed as the ultimate act of courage. It also explains his unhesitating prediction of Hector's death.